Why didnt you go home?, 11 The chest and Israel and Judah are all living in tents, Uriah told David. He went with Absalom. Second, the Chronicler seemed to indicate that Ahithophel was still alive when David was old and nearing death! Unspoken is a compelling story of Bathsheba and David as told by award-winning author Francine Rivers. This article has offered a novel contribution to the seemingly unending and unnecessary debate between Muslims and Christians on the appropriate age of marriage and the baseless criticisms of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) for his marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her). So, either way, it seems that the name in 1 Chronicles 11:36 was a textual corruption, and thus, unreliable. 23. However, I will add that seven years is noticeably young, even by the standards of the time. Webthe Judaism of Moses and David -- Messianic Redemption. 5 The woman conceived and sent word to David. It should be noted that the Bible does not state Bathsheba was _ years old. How could they both be alive in 1 Chronicles 27 when Ahithophel supposedly committed suicide in 2 Samuel 17? These include Adam Clarke,[56] Matthew Henry,[57] Joseph Caryl,[58] Henry Hammond,[59] and Griffith Williams. [1] In this follow-up article, I will present powerful evidence that will silence the rabid Christians who criticize Muhammads marriage to Aisha, inshaAllah. This relationship probably led to Ahithophels disloyalty (2 Samuel 15:12)., [18] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/ghe/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel was very likely the grandfather of Bathsheba, [19] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/hcc/2-samuel-11.html#3, The grandfather of Bethsabee is supposed to have revolted against David, to revenge the wrong done to her., [20] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jfu/2-samuel-23.html#34, Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite , [ Eliy`aam (Hebrew #463)] omitted in the parallel list of 1 Chronicles 11:1-47; traditionally believed to be the same as the person mentioned, 2 Samuel 11:23 (Jerome, Quaest. We have already seen evidence in a previous article that the marriage was Biblically valid. 2 Samuel 11:3 states that Bathsheba was the daughter of Eliam. Hence, this appeal fails to prove that the two Eliams in 2 Samuel were different people. [32] John Phillips, The John Phillips Commentary Series: Exploring Psalms: An Expository Commentary, Vol. Indeed, this is highly unlikely given that Barzillai the Gileadite, who was 80 years old at the time of the revolt and was a supporter of David, was not willing to cross the Jordan river with David to go to Jerusalem from Mahanaim after Absaloms defeat and death because he was too old.[65]. This article has offered a novel contribution to the seemingly unending and unnecessary debate between Muslims and Christians on the appropriate age of marriage and the baseless criticisms of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) for his marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her). WebEvery step was taken at the initiative of David. Father of Bathsheba, whose first husband was a Hittite, 1 Samuel 11:3 (= 1 Chronicles 3:5 , where Eliam is called Ammiel ). And the claim that Allah is a moon God has been debunked many times. 25:3). We will use two main sources for this: 2 Samuel and Psalm 55 (though other books will also be used). Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. Furthermore, according to 2 Samuel 15:31, upon finding out about Ahithophel, David prayed to God to: turn Ahithophels counsel into foolishness.. Son of Ahithophrl and father of Bathsheba (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/e/eliam.html). Though this is said to be a prayer of Moses, who probably lived some 250 years before the reign of David, it still finds corroboration in the time of David, since Barzillai was 80 years old at the time of Absaloms revolt, and David himself lived for 70 years. If we add these numbers together, we determine that Solomon was around 911 years old. Could you also so a video refuting Islam Critiqued on the age of Mary. According to 2 Samuel 15:30, David was on the Mount of Olives when he found out about Ahithophel. In fact, the ages of women are not mentioned except in a few places (e.g., the age of Sarah when she gave birth to Isaac). Im sorry for making a claim that makes you think that I was criticizing Islam. The record does not make the impression that Ahithophel was an older man than David. Since this is now firmly established, we may ask what relevance it has in determining Bathshebas age at the time of her marriage to David. Whenever I teach about the story of Davids sin against Bathsheba, I encourage my students to stand up for her. Thus, it also means that he was between 4448 years old when he first encountered Bathsheba, who The reason is given in the genealogical tables, which show that he was the grandfather of Bathsheba, and that his son Eliam was the comrade and friend of Uriah., [27] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tpc/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel, the grandfather of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 15:12; 2 Samuel:3), [29] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/barnes/psalms/55.htm, [30] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-13.htm, [31] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/poole/psalms/55.htm, that person who was the chief contriver and promoter of this rebellion under Absalom, even to Ahithophel, of whom he spoke [in] Psalm 55:13; and though he doth not excuse the rest, as we have seen, yet he lays the chief blame upon him, and here he adds new aggravations of his treason.. There is virtual consensus among the commentators that the meaning of this phrase is that Davids betrayers would not live half as long as people normally lived at the time. (57.2 x 76.2 cm) Classification: Paintings. 3 David sent someone and inquired about the woman. In fact, Ahithophel is mentioned along with Hushai the Arkite in 1 Chronicles 27:33: Ahithophel was the kings counselor. (2Samuel 16:23) (B.C. Both of them agreed to help. Because, Im a Sunni Muslim and Im planning to debunk all anti-islamic claims and anti-islamic arguments. This verse is crucial. Six times in one paragraph (vv. Add an answer. [4] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. [73] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. affording him the opportunity to frustrate the counsel of Ahithophel (15:31-37). It reads like a song of the time of Absalom and Ahithophel. If we read 2 Samuel 12, when Nathan the prophet came to David, he provided the parable of the rich man and the poor man as a way to trap David into confessing his sin. Oops, Im sorry, I thought you were Christian. She was most likely between the ages of 12-14, which means a 40 year old man married such a young girl. However, this was clearly not the norm (even if true). He betrayed David by joining Absaloms revolt. All which agrees to Achitophel., [47] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/whe/psalms-55.html#13, From this rapid survey of the general calamity, David turns to the chief supporter of the rebellion, his former chief counsellor, Ahithophel. The only solution would be to assume that Ahithophel was mentioned in passing and was actually dead (the Chronicler states that Ahithophel was succeeded by Jehoiada). 7 When Uriah came to him, David asked about the welfare of Joab and the army and how the battle was going. David was sinful because he had taken another mans wife, not that he had slept with a 7-year old. [6] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/smiths-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html, [7] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ats/a/ahithophel.html, Ahithophel seems to have been the grandfather of Bathsheba., [8] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/a/ahithophel.html, Ahithophel was the mainspring of the rebellion. word was brought to him [David] that Ahithophel had gone over to the side of Absalom, [49] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/eastons-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html, brother of insipidity or impiety, a man greatly renowned for his sagacity among the Jews. 52, or the Ziphites, Ps. [68] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. My bad. This is not a matter of controversy. [100] Perhaps most controversial is his refusal to assign a particular age to serve as a cutoff. Title: The Toilet of Bathsheba. Since Bathsheba could not have been older than 20 at the time (since Ahithophel was 39 years old and Eliam was probably in his late 20s), which means that at the time of Solomons birth, she was between 911 years old, with 11 being the conservative estimate based on the conservative estimate for Solomons age (9 years). [45] John MacArthur, The MacArthur Bible Commentary (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005), p. 636. Thus, Solomon was 911 years old at the time of his great-grandfathers death. Called Ammiel, 1 Chronicles 3:5. The reader should recall that Hushai the Arkite was the double-agent in 2 Samuel 17 who persuaded Absalom to ignore Ahithophels advice on how to fight David. The success of Absalom would probably have been fatal to Bath-sheba; it would certainly have barred Solomon, Ahithophels great-grandson, from the throne. Then she returned home. And my master Joab and my masters troops are camping in the open field. Ellicotts Commentary for English Readers not only questions this interpretation but also the traditional assumption of Davidic authorship: Its date and authorship must be left in the region of mere conjecture. It should also be pointed out that there is no indication that Bathshebas marriage to either Uriah or David was seen as abnormal or immoral. Before we begin, let us see what the Jewish scholars said about Bathshebas age when she gave birth to Solomon (dont worry, this is not the main evidence). Absalom calculated on his adhesion from the first (2 Samuel 15:12); the history does not directly say why, but incidentally it comes out: he was father of Eliam (or by transposition Ammiel, 1 Chronicles 3:5), the father of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:3; 2 Samuel 23:34; 2 Samuel 23:39)., [9] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hbd/a/ahithophel.html, He may have been the grandfather of Bathsheba, Davids partner in sin and wife, [10] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hdb/a/ahithophel.html, Being Bathshebas grandfather, he had been alienated by Davids criminal conduct, [11] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/mbd/a/ahithophel-.html, A Gilonite, grandfather of Bathsheba, and a very wise counsellor of David, [12] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/rpd/a/ahithophel.html, Some have endeavored to account for Ahithophels treason by the supposition that, as it seems likely he was Bath-shebas grandfather, he wished to revenge on David the evil done to her. Using Psalm 55:23, it would mean that Ahithophel could not have gone past the age of 45 years (note again that this is the conservative estimate). As the Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Commentary, Jehoiadas life was protracted to unusual longevity. [105] This agrees with Biblical standards as well. The adultery scandal and the subsequent revolt by Absalom and Ahithophel would have required a clarification, but only if the author meant to refer to different people. If Ahithophel was Bathshebas grandfather, then determining his approximate age would allow us to estimate Bathshebas age as well. The estimation of Bathshebas age is indeed based primarily on the interpretation of Psalm 55, and especially verse 23 (see objection #2 below). A minority of scholars questioned the application of the psalm to Ahithophel. This is the thing that really hurt David, is that Absalom had turned against him., [35] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/psalms/55-13.html, as mine equal: i.e. Or Ammiel, [1 Chronicles 3:5] who was the son of Ahithophel, [2 Samuel 23:34] who might, for the dishonour done by David to his niece Bathsheba, be the readier to conspire against him, and to take part with Absalom., [22] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/isn/psalms-41.html#1, Ahithophel was the grandfather of Bathsheba., [23] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/lmg/2-samuel-15.html#1, The reason for this strong enmity was likely that Ahithophel was the grandfather of Bathsheba, [24] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/mac/2-samuel-12.html#13, He was Bathshebas grandfather; and we are not going wrong, I think, in tracing his passionate hatred, and the peculiar form of insult which he counselled Absalom to adopt, to the sense of foul wrong which had been done to his house by Davids crime., [25] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tsk/2-samuel-23.html#34, Eliam: 11:3; 15:31; 17:23; 1 Chronicles 27:33,34, [26] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tbi/2-samuel-12.html#14, What swept Ahithophel into the ranks of that great conspiracy? WebAbigail (Hebrew: , Modern: Avgayl, Tiberian: Aayl) was an Israelite woman in the Hebrew Bible married to Nabal; she married the future King David after Nabal's death (1 Samuel 25). [62] Later, Ahithophel was with Absalom in Jerusalem. Uriah the Hittite and Eliam, being both of the kings guard (consisting of 37 officers), were intimate, and Uriah married the daughter of his brother officer (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/a/ahithophel.html). One night in Jerusalem, King David was walking upon his rooftop when he spotted a beautiful woman bathing nearby (2 Samuel 11:2). He identified Ahithophel in the commentary on verse 12: Ahithophels perfidy and villany troubled David more than all the rest., [40] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/pulpit/psalms/55.htm, the general sentiment of commentators has always been that Ahithophel is intended. If the historical David (peace be upon him) had indeed married Bathsheba at such a young age (without committing adultery), the marriage would not have been consummated until she was physically mature, which would have been at the onset of puberty. Since David died when he was 70 years old, it means that he was 50 years old when Bathsheba (9-11 years old) gave birth to Solomon. Yet, this objection is based on some flawed premises: why is it assumed that Ahithophel needed to be older than David? In his commentary, Ibn Kathir stated that the age of marriage coincides with the age of puberty. [1] https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2020/06/10/the-age-of-marriage-in-the-bible/. No age is mentioned, but Absalom summoned Ahithophel to come to Hebron from his hometown of Giloh (hence, Ahithophel was known as the Gilohite). [68] Similarly, Smiths Bible Dictionary states that he was approximately 32 years old and died around 1023 BCE (emphasis ours): a native of Giloh, was a privy councillor of David, whose wisdom was highly esteemed, though his name had an exactly opposite signification. Just doing my small part, bro. Thus, while marriage at the onset of puberty was not unusual, the Bible indicates that both marriage and sexual intercourse were sometimes permitted at very young ages (though this does not appear to be the norm). In his commentary, Ibn Kathir stated that the age of marriage coincides with the age of puberty. It is even in Sahih International. The oldest man in the Bible, after the patriarchs, was Jehoiada, who supposedly died at the age of 130 (2 Chronicles 24:15). [The Septuagint calls him Eliab. Ironically, the evidence comes from the life of her grandfather Ahithophel, who happened to be Davids counselor (2 Samuel 15:12) and was involved in Absaloms conspiracy to overthrow David (this is a very important issue that we will consider later). You are committing a tu quoque fallacy!, an informal fallacy that intends to discredit the opponents argument by asserting the opponents failure to act consistently in accordance with its conclusion(s)., Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. Psychologist Dr. Robert Epstein has made the controversial suggestion that young people, regardless of how young, should be allowed to make decisions about marriage and sex provided that they demonstrate that he or she knows about the risks of sexis physically and emotionally mature, and so on, an arbitrary age cutoff necessarily allows incompetent people to gain rights and privileges they probably shouldnt have., The norm that the ulama did come to consensus on was only a general guideline: they prohibited sexual intercourse for girls not able to undergo it, on the basis that otherwise sex could be physically harmful. However, this does not appear to be a reasonable assumption. Even if the psalm itself did not refer to Ahithophel, the verse could still be applied to him, as he was a bloody and deceitful man (from Davids perspective) whose life was violently cut short. First, the account in Chronicles omits the sordid stories of David and Bathsheba and Absaloms revolt, and only mentions some characters in passing, so we do not have much information about Bathsheba, Eliam, or Ahithophel. Bathsheba was described as having 5. Bible: Child Marriage in Ancient Israelite times Paedophilia? The son of Ahithophel (2 Samuel 23:34)., [93] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/2-samuel/11-3.html, Bath-sheba, the daughter of Eliam or Ammiel (1 Chronicles 3:5), one of Davids worthies (2 Samuel 23:34), and son of Ahithophel., [94] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ckb/a/ahithophel.html, According to the Midrash, Ahithophel was Batshebas grandfather., [95] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/p/pelonite.html, [96] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hbd/p/pelonite.html, [97] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hdb/p/pelonite.html, [98] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/p/pelonite.html, [105] http://m.qtafsir.com/Surah-An-Nisa/Giving-Back-the-Property-of-th, Tagged as: 2 Samuel, Absalom, Age of consent, Ahithophel, Bathsheba, Bible, Child Marriage, David, Eliam, Psalm 55, par excellence. In the evening Uriah went out to sleep in the same place, alongside his masters servants, but he did not go down to his own home. 9 However, Uriah slept at the palace entrance with all his masters servants. Yet, as with the attribution of the psalm to Ahithophel, the interpretation of verse 23 was largely unified among the commentators. Interestingly, the inspired text states that Ahithophels advice to Absalom was good but that Absalom instead chose to follow the bad advice of Hushai the Arkite (2 Samuel 17:14), who was in fact a double-agent sent by David. Son of Ahithophel the Gilonite, and one of Davids heroes ( 2 Samuel 23:34 ). Psalm 55 is a prayer of David asking God to save him from his enemies. Bullinger,[35] Thomas Cooke,[36] the Benson Commentary,[37] Clarkes Commentary,[38] John Trapp,[39] the Pulpit Commentary,[40] Hawkers Poor Mans Commentary,[41] the Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Commentary,[42] Keil and Delitzsch Old Testament Commentary,[43] the Lange Commentary on the Holy Scriptures,[44] the MacArthur Bible Commentary,[45] Wesleys Explanatory Notes,[46] and Whedons Commentary on the Bible,[47] also identify Ahithophel as the subject of the psalm. [78] Finally, in Acts 13:22, God is quoted as testifying about David as a man after my own heart. She was two years old, on our scheme, when David became king. Mar 27, 2012 Deba rated it it was amazing. David didnt seduce Bathsheba; he raped her. Ironically, the evidence comes from the life of her. The couple had concluded the marriage contract when Aisha was only six but had waited to consummate the marriage until she reached physical maturity.[103]. Others may come to accept the evidence presented but will still attempt to downplay it. This was also the conclusion of Jewish and Christian commentators. And do not give the weak-minded your property, which Allah has made a means of sustenance for you, but provide for them with it and clothe them and speak to them words of appropriate kindness. He lived well past half [the] days of the normal lifespan. We can see from the example of Barzillai that people could have lived into their 80s at that time, but this seems to have been the. Books will also be used ) Samuel 17 Phillips, the interpretation of verse 23 largely! Of Moses and David as told by award-winning author Francine Rivers a young girl conceived and sent word to.! Asking God to save him from how old was bathsheba when she met david enemies determine that Solomon was 911. 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